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websites back in the 90s: "this site best visualized in the big monopoly company's one web browser, your mozilla browser will give you problems"

websites in the 2020s: "this site best visualized in the big monopoly company's one web browser, your mozilla browser will give you problems"

@hadriscus History doesn't repeat itself, but they just won't stop pushing these remakes

@elilla Websites in 2022: Why do you even want to visit us in a web browser, just use our app!

@galaxis oh yeah if you're using a mobile browser that's how it is. and then you have to use things like teddit and picuki to read stuff in a browser without a burner account. still haven't found something that lets me read people post "public" on facebook, without a facebook account

@galaxis @elilla you can't install an ad blocker in our app and we can also sell valuable real time location data if you install our app

@elilla Blaming Mozilla has some mafia vibes. "Of course, you may choose to use Mozilla's browser, but if you do, we cannot guarantee your safety."

"download the app", a depressingly ubiquitous statement.
This cyclic dominance of a monopoly, a perpetual characteristic of large scale capitalism.
Similarly, "cloud computing" is a return to mainframe server-thin client environment?

@citc there's always been a pendulum between thin clients and distributed computing, under various names. we put everything on the servers cos it's so cost-efficient and can be accessed anywhere. then the servers get overload, and we put everything in the clients so processing can be done locally. then it becomes a lot of work to administer, so we put it all in the server, etc.

the problem is that at each iteration of the cycle we control less and less of the machinery, software and data, and the capitalists grab a larger chunk to own every time the pendulum swings.

@elilla And yet Mozilla still somehow holds the same market share while everyone else has gained and lost

@elilla

Okay, but different big monopoly company browser.... That's progress, right?

...right?

@nattiegoogie @elilla at least back then we had big monopoly company dialect, and standards, and these were different, and standards were of manageable size, and you could plausibly implement a new standard-compliant browser engine.

But now the big monopoly is the one in charge of writing standards (basically making their company dialect a standard), and these standards grew to such an insurmountable size that nobody will ever be able to create a standard-compliant browser engine again. (I mean, MS with their billions of dollars spent five years to make one, and gave up in the end)

@IngaLovinde @nattiegoogie

oh come on, don't be unfair. it's not like one monopolist company controls all the standards and overcomplicates them in the interest of preserving absolute control.

it's a cartel of 3 companies doing that. also the one who makes the browser bought out Mozilla too

@elilla @IngaLovinde @nattiegoogie a thing I found surprising is that the SerenityOS folks are both (a) making their browser 'from scratch', and (b) trying to, I think, get to where it would support running Discord.

Admittedly, like, SerenityOS is a hobby project operating system which presumably has a long way to go before it could imagine being used for real work, idk, and it's something explicitly aimed at developers. But still, like, that's a little impressive (to me.)

... of course I suppose there's a major difference between making a browser that can run Discord and you're impressed, and making a browser that runs everything the way people expect of a browser.

@autumnal @elilla @IngaLovinde

A popular, privacy-focused company, DuckDuckGo, best known for their private search engine, actually just released the Beta version of their own, written-from-scratch browser (or at least, not on top of the Chrome engine).

Still beta, still buggy and lacking a lot of the features people expect in a browser, but nevertheless, a promising project to keep an eye on.

@nattiegoogie @autumnal @IngaLovinde my dream was to code a workable modern lynx or eww, then I looked at all that it would entail and remembered why I hate programming.

(there is actually a modern w3m; it cheats by running firefox then re-rendering the rendered graphics in console characters.)

then I found out about gemini, and now I don't have a website anymore, only a gemini capsule.

@nattiegoogie @autumnal @elilla
> DuckDuckGo chose to use the WebKit rendering engine that underpins Apple's Safari browser rather than the more common Chromium engine used by other browsers startups such as Opera and Brave.

@autumnal @elilla @nattiegoogie browser that can run discord web app is already a huge feat, not that far away from a browser than runs everything. (Of course unless they cut corners and make it more of a discord client.)

But I don't think they will get there...

@elilla
With the "They Live" glasses on: Best visualized in Lynx or Emacs.

@socialsquirrel "best visualised by quitting the web and go read weird little zines in gemini instead"

@elilla
Hi, randomly stopping to tell I wanted to fav all your interventions I realised. Interesting to read :)

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